Interesting that you say that "These are the people who do not jump through the hoops required to legally carry a concealed handgun", as I know that to be untrue, firsthand. I'd like to think these three particular individuals are the exception to the norm, but I fear them just the same.

Slam dunk!

Maybe people are sticking up for him because he's dead now and can't stick up for himself?

"If some thug was coming at me and smashing my head on the sidewalk"

Wow. What news are YOU reading?? Seriously??

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/29/10915887-police-video-shows-george-zimmerman-shortly-after-trayvon-martin-shooting

I am highly doubting this man was attacked by Trayvon. But if he was...Zimmerman was FOLLOWING HIM WITH A WEAPON!! Duh - would you not defend yourself from some maniac following you??

I too have a photo flipping off the camera (as do many people). Classless and tacky? Perhaps. Grounds for justifying murder? NO WAY.

i breezed through that link and his twitter posts. maybe 10% of the posts are his (the rest are at him), mostly in "gangsta" speak, talking about smoking trees (weed), being lazy and wishing people happy birthday. yeah, maybe you're right, he deserved to die. (sarcasm)

Wow, that came off as terribly intimidating and threatening. Does Heather now have grounds to kill you?

Because he was 6 feet tall he deserved to die? Seriously?? Because he had some questionable tweets (so do I btw) he deserved to die?? Because Bo was at an underage party (most of my friends did this as well) he deserved to die?? What is wrong with you people???!!!!

God help you if anything like this happens to someone you love. You people are really testing karma with the words your chose. Life is too short to have this much hate.

Heather again you ignore the FACTS that Bo was Eluding police, was on probation, and had broken into a house. Just keep twisting the facts to suit yourself! How do you sleep at night? Fortunately for me, I an secure in the belief that my loved one are intelligent enough not to go around attacking people or break into someone house! Just keep focusing on the distorted image Trayvon's family is portraying, it is just to make themselves money. The image portrayed by the real Trayvon surely couldn't do that so they have to resort to deceiving the gullible public for their profit!

No. I am not being used. I am free to think how I chose. You cannot clean up a smashed face and broken nose. And besides, I think Trayvon had a right to NON LETHALLY defend himself against a crazy man following him in his car and then on foot while carrying a weapon. Get real.

The media can manipulate large numbers of stupid people to form very strong opinions without any actual facts, just read Heather and Kendra's words.

I could possibly feel insulted by being called stupid....then I consider the source and I laugh. Heartily.

Heather it is your right as an American to be a victim if that is your choice. Proclaim to the world that you hate guns and there are no guns in your house, but do not expect the rest of us to be as irresponsible to our family and loved ones.

God Bless Scott Walker, God Bless the 2nd Amendment, and God Bless the FN-57 in my holster.

You're right, Scott, it is your Constitutional right to protect your family and defend yourself. That is un-debatable. It is no one's right, however, to virtually stalk a kid who was merely WALKING HOME and kill him.
These are two very different things.

Thank you for being sensible, Dirk. It seems to be a lacking quality these days.

"We all know there are gun nuts out there that would really like to find an excuse to use their weapon in "self-defense".
And just carrying a weapon, unless as a professional like a policeman, implies paranoia, hostility, immaturity, and feelings of male sexual inadequacy."

That's not a serious comment, is it? I'm sure as heck do not live in your fairly tale world where only cops have guns and crimes are committed only when cops are around to protect me. Do you remember the pregnat woman shot and killed because she would not give up her purse? The crimes are real, and every person has a God-given right to protect their own life. I carry a gun because it is life insurance against someone who wants to do me, my wife, or my daughters serious harm. It's like fire insurance on my home. I hope to never need it, but if I do need it, I'll be glad I had it.

On another note, why is anyone making judgements based on speculation? We do not have all the facts, yet people are crying for "justice" for Trayvon, or trying to say Zimmerman was "justified". I don't believe any of us were there, or knows enough to make a vaild judgement. That is a job for the cops, DA, and ultimately the courts if it gets that far. Anyone who makes a case for their position based on assumptions about these cases is guity of pushing their own biased agenda.

Its okay Dirk, we will protect pantywaist liberal males like you from the thugs.

@Brian C- Why would my comments not be serious? I did not say that only cops should have guns and crimes are committed only when cops are around to protect me. I did not say any of the things you imply.
I own several guns. They are long guns, rifles and shotguns. I use them on occasion when I go to the cabin. But I am not one to go around with a .45 on my hip in public spaces like a wild west cowboy.
If you were worried about your wife and daughters, you would not carry a loaded handgun, particularly with them around. Statistics show you are more likely to shoot yourself, your wife, or your daughters then engage in justifiable homicide.
As for making judgements based on speculation, you made a few incorrect ones about me just in your comments.

@Alfed -
You may want to reconsider calling me a pantywaist, if your definition of pantywaist is someone who does not pack heat openly or hidden under their outergarments.
I grew up with guns, was on a rifle team while in high school, earned sharpshooter rank with the NRA at the time, and still have long guns.
But no, absoIutely not would I pack a loaded gun in public, I apparently do not have that juvenile need, and even trained policemen accidentally shoot themselves and innocent people.
Just because someone packs a Glock 9mm does not exempt them from being "pantywaists." Maybe they are carrying that gun because otherwise they feel inadequate, vulnerable, and fragile.

Dirk, again, it is your right as a citizen of this country to be a victim. You want to live life as a victim against the thugs of society, so be it. But thank God there are more wise and prudent folks in government currently that know the world is an unsafe place and if need be we can protect our family and our property with conceal carry and the castle doctrine.
Enter my home unlawfully and I will guarantee you meet your maker, reminds me of a tombstone I saw once in Montana:
His life is done
He had no gun

@Dirk: Statistics can be twisted to show whatever you want. Statistics also show if I do not drive my car, my chances of getting into an accident decrease. So therefore, according to your logic, I should not drive my car. I guess I'm just one of those paranoid, hostile, immature, males with feelings of sexual inadquecy-at least until I strap on my firearm-then I am invincible. If you choose to be a victim, so be it, that is your choice. I choose to be prepared.

So i have a fire extinguisher in my house and smoke detectors .. does this imply paranoia, immaturity, and feelings of male sexual inadequacy ... Why can't i protect myself???

Johnny Blade - No one is saying you cannot protect yourself with fire extinguishers and smoke detectors. If you are not a felon, etc. you can keep a gun in the house, I keep a long gun or two. However, the analogy you use is extremely faulty. You do not carry these out on the street, and it is hard to instantly kill someone with them.
You know what I am talking about, that the loaded gun is your answer to primal needs to be an alpha male, when without it you are really way down the Greek alphabet.

Fight fire with fire, right? Why not just have an all out shoot out right in front of Longfellow. I can just picture it...a bunch of armed crossing guards trying to de-escalate a situation by taking pot shots at the "bad guys" from 50+ yards.

Clearly you would rather have the kids be terrorized by predatory sociopaths. As the gangsters say, "Tosa is easy pickins'".

A better way would be to demand a new Tosa police chief. Someone who doesn't say stunningly stupid and politically-motivated things like "crime in Tosa is not on the rise." The Longfellow-to-60th area is essentially unpatrolled, despite our violent crime crimewave. I have commented before on the Tosa police nearly-unmarked cruisers who hide on the service drive between the north Longfellow parking lot and the cemetery. Well, now they have moved to a new non-patrol spot. Now I see them back in the cemetery itself, on a grave access road on the north side of the cemetery, still overlooking a tiny slice of 76th street. Even if they have permission from the owners, I consider this to be vile and disrespectful, and incompetent. They can see almost nothing from this particular vantage point, which is a total waste of taxpayers' money. A real, marked, occupied patrol car should be parked in PLAIN VIEW somewhere at 76th and North for two hours every day during the rush. That is simply obvious.

Easy cowboy. I was actually making more of a comparative joke....and not insinuating that Heather should/would come out and shoot you.

I wouldn't mind seeing a psychological exam as part of the permitting process if you chose to exercise your constitutional rights under the 1st amendment.....oh wait....you don't need a permit to exercise your constitutional rights.........oh wait......

Scott Brown
scottfrommilwaukee@gmail.com

Let's have a psychological exam to allow voting, both gun ownership and voting are constitutional rights, let's be fair now.

I like the way you think, Alfred :)

Why are you so afraid to put your real name up to begin with? Big, tough guy that you are.

Upset father with a handgun. Now, that is something we can all worry about.

you figured it out? that's creepy

@Stormy Weather -- Details of what? Had Zimmerman seen Martin crouching in bushes or trying doors to see if they were unlocked? What made him, in Zimmerman's estimation, a F****** A****** who was going to get away?

Mr Pantywaist, why do you continue to repeat the lies of the race baiters and poverty pimps? why not read the police report? It's online, all of the witnesses back up Mr Zimmerman account of the situation. Just google it, search for the truth Mr. Pantywaist, don't listen to Al Sharpton .

I just read the police report. What witness statements? There were none with the report I read. The physical evidence is consistent with there being an altercation and Zimmerman being knocked on his back and hit in the nose. There is nothing to corroborate what led to the scuffle -- other than the account of Trayvon's girlfriend who heard him being accosted, a scuffle, and then the phone falling to the ground -- which contradicts Zimmerman's account. But neither of those statements are in the police report.

This is a good point someone made:
It is illegal to post wanted posters for an American Citizen who is not even "wanted" by the law. I am withholding judgement re: Zimmerman before all the facts come in, but so far the only crime that had been committed for certain in this case is the crime committed against Zimmerman by the New Black Panthers. Someone in that organization needs to be arrested for stalking and inciting violence.

Because it gives you the needed anonymity to spew whatever hateful ignorance you feel, Gordon. That's why. Put her address up? So a pack of gun-toting bible-thumpers can harass her in person. Sure.

It seems that a number of people spew hateful ignorance under their real names around here as well...

I wrote your name because after what you said on FB and now on here, I thought your comments were threatening in tone. I wanted you to know I knew who you were. There was no breaking of ethics. I happen to have pretty good intuition, made an educated guess based on your grammar and you told me I was right. Period. I think people would be more careful with their words and venom if they knew people could find out who they were. I did not put your full name, did I? But you are still threatening to put my address?? In a forum full of people talking about shooting people??!! And then you ask me to remove your name???!!! Seriously.

Heather:

I don't believe that his first comment about you using your real name was an actual threat against you.

The way I read it, it's more of an observation that criminals are more likely to target people/homes that are known to not have weapons. Making a public declaration that you do not have a gun in your home, you may be placing yourself at a higher risk of being a victim of a break in (at least in theory).

I think we should not encourage Dirty Harry wannabes to go out armed at night confronting 'suspicious' people. More people will be shot and killed.

We also should not be encouraging anyone to take action against people who may not be as guilty as the media determines them to be...

I think that the media does society a disservice when they provide coverage that gives readers an impression that may not reflect what actually happened.

I don't encourage the Black Panthers and the people who tweeted the address of the wrong Zimmermans. I also think Al Sharpton should stay out of it,. His track record is not good.

However, the Sanford police needed to conduct a better investigation than they did. It's unfortunate that media pressure had to be applied for that to happen.

Who's to say that they were not conducting an adequate investigation without media pressure? It's generally bad policy to leak details of an ongoing investigation to the public...

We agree on this. Everyone from the POTUS on down is inciting the masses. Another example of pitting the races against each other. The media is always fueling the fire with innuendos. First thing out of the gate it was black against white. Even though if it was for affirmative action purposes, they would have labeled Zimmerman a Mexican. It seems they just can't have people getting along.

Gordon, no offense, but I can't really follow any bit of whatever point you're attempting to make. Punctuation may help.

Yes, and they told him he didn't need to continue following the suspicious person. But he did, and there was a scuffle and a shooting.

A witness saw the scuffle between Zimmerman and Martin already underway, with Zimmerman getting the worst of it. The girlfriend's account might cast light on how the scuffle began -- something that was not seen by the eye-witness.

Randy1949 - The dispatcher told Zimmerman that he didn't have to do that (meaning Zimmerman didn't have to follow him). Zimmerman's response was, "OK". Zimmerman also went on to talk about where the police should meet him when they arrive. This does not sound like someone who is hunting down a teenager. Common sense tells me that at this point in time, it is highly unlikely that he is following Trayvon.

Also... I'm sure the investigators have either recreated or are planning on recreating where the shooting took place. They know exactly where Zimmerman was parked, and what time Zimmerman exited the vehicle. Seems simple to me - How far could Zimmerman have walked when he followed Trayvon or how far could he have run if he was chasing him. They know exactly where Trayvon died and they know exactly when the gun went off because you can hear it on a different phone call. Seems like they can easily recreate this situation to see if it matches up to what Zimmerman says or if it matches up to what Trayvon's girlfriend says. Whatever happens in the end, it is just a sad situation for everyone involved...

Actually YOU just gave yourself away now too. Why you guys don't just use your names but use the same verbiage...weird. Anyway, condescending?? Get a dictionary. And yes, now I AM being condescending.

About guns. You know what? I am not unreasonable. If laws were more strict and they did require psych tests and REAL background checks and it wasn't so easy to get and use a gun against people...I would have less of a problem with them.

But there is no way I can read what people write on these forums and feel okay about the population being armed.

I hope you all have a decent weekend. I have a funeral to prepare for and life is too short to waste arguing with mean, vicious people who do nothing but call names and act less mature than my 7 year old. I hope you find some peace in your lives and stop feeling the world is out to get you. I hope you can one day crawl out from those foxholes and spread some joy instead of hate.

FYI - I am not talking to all of you. Some of you here are being rational and reasonable. I thank you for that.

Hmmm...What shall I change my handle to? Arrogant? Insensitive? Heartless? Mean? Vicious? Mean? Spreader of hate? So dumb I need a dictionary?
Now please name one instance of where I called anyone a name? I think you need to look in a mirror.
I have some really good zingers to throw at you right now, but I will withhold them.
If Patch is trying to attract more readers, I think many will be turned off by the way the Patch bloggers and editors treat people. Will I recommend Patch to anyone? NOPE.

@conservachick -- I think the name-calling prize goes to Alfred.

~signed, MR. Pantywaist

Really Heather? A psych test to own a gun? You sure appreciate your first amendment, but the second amendment requires submission to personal evaluation. It's nice that you exploit your irrational fear of guns, to make yourself feel better. You must have forgotten that the second amendment is the only right, protecting all other rights we are afforded.
Why stop there, since you can't really take your rights seriously. Why not subject people to a battery of tests, to make sure they'll be good parents, or live life as a law abiding citizen. Your line of logic is the reason this country is headed into the toilet. More laws and governance does not a free people make.

HAHA! Sorry, that was humorous.

You think that gun users don't look other people in the eye?

Gun nuts like some of the above posters never want to be separated from their hot, heavy pistols. Why? Because they are scared and weak without them.

It's all relative. Certainly an infantry soldier wouldn't want to be far from his/her weapon on the battlefield, would they? Does that make them scared and weak?

Good grief, a soldier is in a war. In the case of the "mean streets" of Tosa, the war is in your own mind. Have a little self-confidence, and don't be so terrified of ever being uncomfortable or ever being a victim. Otherwise, you'll just be another loose cannon chasing unarmed teenagers around the neighborhood.

As I said, it's all relative. The point was that your making blanket statements about gun owners being scared and weak is pretty stupid...

...and I don't live in Tosa, nor do I own a gun.

No, Dung, gun owners are a mixed group, I'm sure. Gun crazies, who have to have their cold, hard, steel lover with them at all times are fearful, deranged, perverse wretches.

...or they could have been victimized in the past and are truly and sincerely concerned that it can happen again.

Dung, I'm sure that's the case for some of them. However, in those cases, I would suggest that psychotherapy is a much better investment than guns and ammo. Carrying a loaded weapon constantly is an accident waiting to happen, cloaked in the illusion of control.

It seems to me that the anti-gun zealots are just as crazy as the gun nuts. Gun nuts seem to have an irrational fear of becoming a victim, anti-gun nuts seem to have an irrational fear of gun owners...

Police officers carry loaded weapons constantly--is that an accident waiting to happen?

@CowDung -- Police officers who carry loaded weapons are less of an accident waiting to happen, because they are trained and there is some psychological screening before they are allowed onto the force.

Unfortunately, George Zimmerman seems to have some issues with that. He has prior incidents of domestic violence and one of resisting a police officer with violence.

1. Gun nuts like some of the above posters never want to be separated from their hot, heavy pistols.
2. another loose cannon chasing unarmed teenagers around the neighborhood.
3. Gun crazies, who have to have their cold, hard, steel lover with them at all times are fearful, deranged, perverse wretches.
4. I would suggest that psychotherapy is a much better investment than guns and ammo. Carrying a loaded weapon constantly is an accident waiting to happen, cloaked in the illusion of control.

Are you talking about law abiding citizens or criminals? Law abiding citizens who passed a background check and took a course in gun safety. Did the criminal gang bangers go through this process?

@ mau

Oh, please. The inability of anyone on the right to call out gun-crazy vigilantes is the only reason they can justify such irresponsible laws as "Stand your ground," or such absurd proposals as carrying guns anywhere and everywhere.

Admit it - some of your so-called "responsible gun owners" are people who get turned on by stroking their long, hard barrels. Just listen to Zimmerman in those calls; his voice is trembling with the anticipation of a 26-year-old virgin (which, living with his parents, he may well have been). Zimmerman, of course, was one of your model citizens who got a permit despite a history of aggressive behavior and encounters with the police.

Then again, I don't really expect that kind of ability to distinguish one thing from another from you, mau, since you're a confused birther who doesn't believe that the President of the USA is an American citizen.

Taoist is no more mature than a child who is always bullying, name calling and labeling.

I'm sorry, mau - is "birther" not a label that fits you? Have you changed your mind since Monday? Are you ready to apologize to the President for your baseless slander?

I'm capable of having a reasonable discussion, but I'm not above getting dirty when these comments devolve into a cesspool of conservative talking points and racist nonsense. We're all childish bullies here, mau - the difference is that some of us can dish it out AND take it.

I don't normally "dish" it out and get "dirty". I have more respect for others' opinions than that. I wouldn't be here if I couldn't take it. I've gotten worse comments than yours.

I don't cower, Alfred, and I never have. If you ever had to use a weapon in real life, your sweaty palms and tiny pants tent would make you a menace to yourself.

@JRH -- First of all, that's Sean Bean. Boromir, among other roles he has played, and he's a tough customer even in real life.

Second, though, that was a movie. That black actor was paid for it to go down that way.

@Randy1949 -

That scene was the first thing I thought of when I read the quoted supposition in HRG's write-up - it just seemed relevant to me.

But you're right - maybe Dennis Leary in 'Judgment Night' (1993) is a more accurate representation ;-)

@Jorge - Most people would agree, but what incident are you talking about? You made up some dialogue and "facts" that do not seem to match the evidence of the Martin case.

Maybe HRG could set the example.

Exactly why I'm not bothering commenting on most of this stuff much less even reading it. This is happening all too often lately.

@mau -

What the hell happened???

I'm AWOL for a little while and things go completely haywire around here!

I've been waiting for you to come back. I do miss your comments. I don't know what happened. It's like we are having a full moon. Some of these strings are so full of anger, lies and hate that I can't lower myself to comment.

I also do not like the change the Patch made. I liked seeing the latest comments highlighted on the right side. Hope they aren't taking directions from Facebook.

You know nothing about my morals or ethics. I spend much of my life helping others and caring about others. Yesterday a man at the store did not have enough money for his groceries and started to take them out of the bags to chose which to put back. Without hesitation I handed the cashier my debit card. I do not have extra money and I had no idea what the bill was. I was overcome with empathy for the man - and for all I know he could have been the biggest Walker supporter, a gun carrier, anyone. I don't base how I treat people on their opinions. I have a VERY high moral standard. They may be different from yours, but they are not worth less.

I have seen comments by conservachick and upset father for a while now (was even warned about conservachick months ago...not to bother with dialogue) and I assure you that the two of you DO in fact treat people based on their opinions. So don't either of you DARE to judge me. You do not know me or anything real about me.

I will not continue to comment on this thread. It has become worse than a playground full of bullies. I will not participate.

@HRG -

I know that this is off topic, but I'm really not liking the 'new' and 'improved' 'What People Are Saying' section of the Patch. Is there anyway to convince the powers that be to revert it back to the old system?

Let me second what Hoffa said -- the new form makes it harder to follow comments and spot when there's new activity on a thread. Especially for people like me, whose email alerts don't work.

I'm thirding Hoffa's dislike.

Don't know if it will do any good, but there are a couple of Patch sites where they posted an article highlighting the changes and ask for feedback on the 'new look' of the page. I expressed my dislike on the Fox Point/Bayside Patch site, but I seem to be the only one.

HRG has the deer in the head lights look, and its quite fitting given the crap she wrote. Fact is, Zimmerman is not some gun toting NRA conservative as she's trying to make it out as. She is a fat liar. Zimmerman is a registered Democrat, and the fact that she's making it left vs right is disgusting.

Whites are taught to fear blacks? Wow what a dumb statement. People react to the way people portray themselves. There is a whole "thug" thing in the black rap and hip-hop culture, and if kids want to act that part then in turn people will judge them as violent and/or ignorant.

@oak creek resident -

Drop the personal attacks already! Do you not understand English? Are you incapable of making an intelligent comment without containing a personal attack?

What is your freakin deal???

These personal attacks actually do more harm to our side than good, so either clean it up and stick to ideas or else leave the discussion to the grown ups on the Patch.

This is a warning!

Helping a man buy groceries was wrong? Or are you talking about something else? Seriously, what is your problem?