UPDATE: Brookfield Spa Shooter Takes His Own Life After Killing 3, Injuring 4
Suspect, estranged husband of spa employee, found dead of self-inflicted wound following Sunday morning shooting near Brookfield Square mall.
Brookfield, WI — Four people were killed and four others injured Sunday morning at a mass shooting at the Azana Salon & Spa across the street from the Brookfield Square mall.
Among the dead is the man police say was the shooter, 45-year-old Radcliffe Haughton of Brown Deer. His body was found inside a locked room in the spa, 200 N. Moorland Rd., Brookfield Police Chief Dan Tushaus said.
Also killed was his estranged wife, 42-year-old Zina Haughton of Brown Deer.
Tushaus said Haughton was the only suspect in the shootings.
The Waukesha County Medical Examiner’s Office on Monday afternoon identified the other deceased victims as Cary L. Robuck, 35, of Racine, and Maelyn M. Lind, 38, of Oconomowoc.
On Tuesday, autopsy reports indicated Zina Haughton died from "multiple gunshot wounds," Lind had a gunshot wound to the head and chest and Robuck was shot in the neck. Radcliffe Haughton committed suicide by a gunshot to his head.
- Associated Bank has set up a benefit fund for Azana Salon & Spa. Donations can be dropped off or mailed to the bank at 1 N. Moorland Rd, Brookfield, WI, 53045
Lind's mother told Patch late Sunday night that her daughter, a spa employee who was working Sunday morning, has four children and one grandson who was born in late August.
Robuck was the mother of two cheerleaders at Racine Horlick High School. Students throughout Racine are all planning to wear purple Monday to support the two students.
Haughton's estranged wife had obtained a four-year restraining order against him on Thursday, after he was arrested for allegedly slashing her car tires in the Azana parking lot on Oct. 4, Tushaus said Sunday night press conference at the Brookfield Public Safety Building. A spa employee earlier Sunday had told Patch the spa also recently had put signs on all but its main door telling employees to keep other doors locked until further notice.
The four injured — all women — were being treated at Froedtert Hospital in Wauwatosa and are expected to survive, the hospital said. Three had surgery and the other was admitted with injuries that did not require surgery. As of 7 a.m. Monday, the hospital said one was in critical condition and three were in satisfactory condition.
Tushaus said the ages of the injured were 22, 30, 32 and 40.
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He said authorities are still trying to positively identify the deceased inside the salon, other than the shooter, and did not offer any details on them. Brookfield's full-time police social worker was at the hospital, helping the victims and their families.
In addition to the four women rushed to Froedtert, another 10 to 12 employees and customers were rescued from the spa, Tushaus said.
A spa employee told Patch one of the women injured was a front desk employee who was pregnant and believed to be due in January. That woman was shot in the neck or shoulder area, but her injuries were not believed to be life-threatening, the employee said.
Tushaus said police believe Haughton took a taxi to Azana Sunday morning. His car at one point was sought by police, who put out a photo of a 2003 Mazda Protege and license plate when it was unknown if Haughton had fled or was inside the spa. But his car was found outside the city limits, police said.
Complicating the rescue was smoke in the building, coming from a small fire police believe Haughton started in a spa hallway with a flammable liquid. The fire set off the business' sprinkling system. A one-pound propane tank was located near the area of the fire, but it was not known whether the suspect had brought the propane tank or if it had been left behind by contractors recently working in the spa.
"We believe this incident was domestic violence related," Tushaus said.
Haughton was arrested, then released
The couple lived in Brown Deer, and police there arrested Haughton either on Oct. 4 for tire-slashing or the following day for domestic violence criminal damage to property. He was booked and released, with a referral for charges sent to the Waukesha County District Attorney's office. No charges had been filed as of Sunday.
On Oct. 8, a temporary restraining order was issued against Haughton, and on Oct. 11 a copy was delivered to Haughton. All of his weapons were supposed to be turned over to the Milwaukee County Sheriff's Department as a condition of the order. Haughton was a former Marine, according to multiple reports.
A spa employee who spoke to Patch said Haughton was out of work and his wife had been working every day straight for the past month to bring in money to pay the bills. However, she recently decided to leave him, and that's when the problems started.
"(She) cut my hair recently and she told me she had left her husband," the employee said. "I told her I was sorry she was going through that."
Couple had two children to consider
The couple has two daughters, ages 12 and 21, the Azana employee told Patch. The 21-year-old daughter worked at the salon in a housekeeping position, the employee said.
Brown Deer School Superintendent Deb Kerr said Monday that Tatiana Haughton, Zina Haughton's younger daughter, is a seventh-grader at Brown Deer Middle School and has attended district schools since kindergarten.
Yasmeen Daniel, Haughton's older daughter from a previous relationship, graduated from Brown Deer High School in 2010 after attending district schools since fourth grade, Kerr said.
"I'm not sure that we had been made aware of the restraining order," Kerr said. "Her parents had met with counselors within the past week. But there was nothing that would have made us aware of any major problems."
Kerr described Tatiana as "a delightful child, and very active in our school plays and in choir and orchestra. She was very involved and a part of our school community."
"They were committed students," Kerr said of both Tatiana and Yasmeen.
"I'm very proud of our school crisis team, and the police chief, and how they've handled this," Kerr said. "We were there waiting for our students as they got off the buses."
Kerr said that counseling was available to students at all Brown Deer schools.
"We don't yet if or when Tatiana will return to Brown Deer Middle School," Kerr said. "We'll be ready for it when it comes."
Spa owner issues statement
Several witnesses said a woman fled the spa screaming that her mother had been shot. It was not known Sunday whether that could have been Yasmeen Daniel talking about her mother.
Azana owner Tami Gemmell issued a statement asking for prayers for the victims and their families. "We are devastated by this tragedy and remain in shock over how this could have happened," Gemmell said.
"Please know that our first concern is for the victims and their families, and for our Azana family. We are grieving over the loss of our colleagues, their families and we are praying for those who are still fighting for their survival."
Bomb squad called to scene
The incident happened about 11 a.m. right as the salon opened and the call came in at 11:09 a.m., Tushaus said. There were at least 15 ambulances on the scene from multiple jurisdictions as far west as Delafield, in addition to the Flight For Life helicopters. Moorland Road, which runs along Brookfield Square mall, was closed.
Tactical units entered the spa and police initially believed there was an improvised explosive device (IED) inside the building, which complicated the process of clearing the spa. Just before 3:30 p.m, police began carrying furniture out of the spa. Individuals were being allowed to go to their cars unescorted in the east parking lot of Brookfield Square, facing the spa.
It turned out that a propane tank left in the building was not an IED, and police said it was unclear Sunday whether it had been left by Haughton or by construction crews doing work in the building.
A bomb squad robot was moving toward Haughton's Brown Deer home just after 4 p.m. and authorites remained on the scene as of 5 p.m. Brown Deer Police Chief Steven Rinzel told JSOnline.com that no explosives were found.
For much of the day, authorities did not know the whereabouts of Haughton. As a result, both Froedtert Hospital and nearby Children's Hospital were put on lockdown. By 4:30 p.m., however, both hospitals were allowing patients and employees to come and go.
Obama, Walker react
President Barack Obama was informed of the salon shooting by his advisor for Homeland Security, John Brennan. He also received a follow-up briefing from FBI Director Bob Mueller and Chief of Staff Jack Lew.
Obama was told the shooting did not appear to be terrorism-related, and he instructed the FBI to ensure that the state and local officials had the full support of the federal government, according to a statement from the White House.
The president and first lady also indicated their thoughts and prayers are with the victims of the shooting and their families.
The same sentiments were echoed by Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker.
"(First Lady) Tonette and I send our thoughts and prayers to the victims.," the governor said in a statement. "Senseless acts of violence leave us with heavy hearts and many questions. Our state will stand with the victims and their families, and we will provide them with the law enforcement and community support they need to heal in the coming days."
Brookfield mayor in church when notified
Brookfield Mayor Steve Ponto told Patch on Sunday evening: "All of us are relieved that the matter has been brought to a resolution."
"It's a tragic thing," he added. "With something like this, it's a bizarre instance and you can't really prevent it, but you can be prepared for it, and I think we were prepared for it. I really appreciate the level of cooperation that we’ve gotten from police of neighboring communities, Milwaukee county and city and the FBI."
Ponto and his wife were attending church services when he started getting phone messages from his two daughters. He ignored them, assuming they were calling about their plans to meet for lunch in Milwaukee's Third Ward. Once he got outside after church had ended, he checked his messages and learned abou the shooting.
Then began a flurry of contacts with Chief Tushaus and Assistant Chief Dean Collins who told Ponto to meet as planned for lunch before heading to a press conference in Brookfield.
"The waitress brought me the (television) remote so that I could turn up the volume whenever there was an update," the mayor said. He said even before Sunday's tragedy, the Brookfield Police Department has been preparing to hold "a special seminar... talking about security of religious facilities. We just want to be proactive and prepared for these kinds of things but sadly you can’t prevent them."
Brookfield has the second Sikh temple in the Milwaukee area — the Oak Creek one was the site of a shooting rampage just 11 weeks ago. Brookfield also has approved construction of a mosque, although a planned fall groundbreaking may not occur until March, a leader told Patch Satuday.
On Aug. 5, Wade Michael Page opened fire at the Sikh Temple in Oak Creek, killing six people and injuring four more, including Oak Creek police Lt. Brian Murphy. Family members of the victims from that shooting were on the scene, consoling victims, according to published reports. There also was a candlelight vigil in the memory of the victims held Sunday night at the temple.
The Brookfield Police Department is familiar with mass shooting incidents. In 2005, Terry Ratzmann opened fire during a Living Church of God worship service at the Sheraton Hotel, killing seven before turning the gun on himself. That hotel is just almost directly across the street from Azana Spa.
Domestic abuse victims urged to call hotline
The Wisconsin Coalition Against Domestic Violence said Sunday's mass shooting underscores the need for greater resources to combat domestic violence.
"This display of horrendous violence in a public place should call all of our attention to the violence and terror that many in Wisconsin live with behind closed doors every day — and to the need to address domestic violence," said Patti Seger, executive director of the WCADV.
"At the state and community-level, we must dedicate resources and resolve that matches the courage of victims," she said.
She urged anyone suffering from domestic violence to get help by calling the National Domestic Violence Hotline (1−800−799−SAFE). "They do not have to face abuse, fear and anxiety alone," Seger said.
Patch editors Jim Price, Mark Maley and Matthew Schroeder contributed to this report.
In This article
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Sheraton Milwaukee Brookfield Hotel
375 S Moorland Rd, Brookfield, WI -
Azana Salon & Spa
200 N Moorland Rd, Brookfield, WI -
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Steve ®
1:14 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Shouldn't be too hard to hunt this guy down in Brookfield.
DICK STEINBERG
1:53 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Steve. people are hurt and bleeding. no time for bigotry
Steve ®
2:04 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Are you holding gauze on their wounds? ?
Nuitari
2:59 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Another crazy hood rat.
spunky farvo
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Why doenst the media mention the race when the perp is black?
David Tatarowicz
1:01 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
@ Steve, Dick and Nuitari ---- If it is true that Ignorance is Bliss --- you are the happiest MF's on earth .....
Randy1949
1:24 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I'm not clear on the details -- was he driving or on foot when he fled?
Steve ®
1:27 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Apparently fled driving a black 03 Mazda so says the tv news
Randy1949
1:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
That means he's either long gone or, more troubling to me, abandoned his car and on foot.
Steve ®
1:38 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Yep, this could get worse......... No one seems to have any good info yet. News conference with police coming up soon but again they have no idea when.
BAH
1:28 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
How awful! I remember the church group that was shot at the Sheraton Hotel by Brookfield Square 7 years ago and how scary it wad because the building wad within walking distance of my old work place.
Christine Griffiths
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
And how scary to remember the shooting at the Shikh Temple. Let's remember that was definately a "hate crime". A hate crime of innocent people just like all these other crimes. Wonder what is going on in Wisconsin these days?
Dan T
1:35 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Wow! Everyday it seems that shootings are in the headlines! Prayers for the victims and justice for the shooter!!! how ever that justice may come.
albert sheridan
2:11 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Don't talk such rubbish. when did prayers ever work?
nkg
3:01 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Albert, prayers work for those who believe in them. Since you obviously don't believe in them, they will never work for you!
2umarjorie
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
prayers dont make things happen or go away. god left that to thhe people. its called common sense, and using the brain. god is an observer, not a director, he has never made things happen.
Cindy Halpern
2:01 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
This is becoming far too commonplace in the United States. As a kid, I road my bike carefree. My parents didn't think I was kidnapped or murdered. I came home for supper and my parents merely scolded me for being late, then we would eat .
Innocence is gone. Even young children know about shootings.
Steve ®
2:06 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Children are always carefree and parents always have worried.
Cookies Mom
2:05 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I hope they find him and fast. It seems that domestic situations which are escalating in violence leave law enforcement's hands tied until something drastic like this happens. I haev long been a supporter of placing the victims of domestic violence and those that appear to be probable victims in some kind of shelter or protective custody because there is no other way to provide them with around the clock protection and protective orders cannot do that either. I know that may seem like an overreaction, but these domestic incidents are proving to be fairly lethal dangers to the public at large as they increase in frequency, intensity, and we are not willing or able to enact any kind of gun control that might prevent some tragedies.
CLB45
2:13 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
It's against the law to shoot and kill people. That's one of the most basic law of any civilization. If a person isn't willing to obey that law, why do you think they would obey a law that says they can't have a firearm? When you people start blaming aberrant behavior on the part of anti-social people for these tragedies, instead of inanimate objects, maybe something can be done.
Nancy Hall
3:04 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Providing protective custody for potential victims of domestic violence would be extremely costly. What you're talking about is providing complete financial support for these people. You can't arrest people because you think they might commit acts of violence in the future, so the potential abusers of the potential victims would be free to go anywhere they chose to go. That would mean that the potential victims wouldn't be able to work, shop, go to school, send their kids to school or otherwise take part in community activities. The target in this instance was working. Who do you think would be willing to pay to provide food, clothing, shelter and other amenities to these potential victims in protective custody?
Cookies Mom
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Anybody that thinks the cost of a protective custody program for domestic violence victims and potential victims would be too costly has not considered the costs society is already looking at in incidents such as these. There is considerable cost to all of us when anyone is shot and killed, there are the costs of law enforcement and other first responsers reacting to these situations, and there are medical costs, survivor benefits, liability costs, litigation costs, etc. I know protective custody would not be cheap; neither is the cost of incidents like these. At least with protective custody or the like, most innocent bystanders would be spared.
Lynne Radcliffe
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
How about *_empowering_* those intended victims to be able to stand up for themselves & stop their abusers?
How about being an advocate & making it easier for them to take care of themselves?
That's a lot less expensive, and much better for society as a whole, than trying to shelter them. Keeping the victims under guard victimizes them again, keeps them powerless, makes them think they're helpless... which is exactly what abusers want. Why play into their way of doing things?
I know several personal-defense instructors (mostly firearms safety) who provide free or low-cost services to people who have a restraining order against someone else, so cost shouldn't be a factor.
Nancy Hall
5:13 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
According to reports, the police found a propane tank and the remains of a fire on the premises, suggesting that the man planned to blow the place up. No amount of empowerment with self defense or firearms training would be protection against a fiery explosion.
What really needs to happen is that the courts and law enforcement agencies need to start taking domestic violence more seriously than is presently the case. Restraining orders are a good start, but they're not granted automatically and they're worthless unless they're enforced.
My own experience with a restraining order, which was violated repeatedly, was that enforcement was spotty and appeared to depend on the bias of the police officer answering the call. When the police finally did arrest my abuser for violating the order; the case was thrown out because there were occasions, unrelated to the arrest, when I had driven our minor children to a public place to meet him for court ordered visitation.
I noticed, in my own case, that the police officers who were most helpful were the ones who seemed to know the most about the laws and about the dynamics of domestic violence. I think that better training for the police and more teeth for domestic violence laws would be more effective than leaving women to fend for themselves, whether trained or not.
albert sheridan
2:09 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
How about some comments, that if guns were not so readily available this (and many others) might not have happened.
CLB45
2:16 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
How about some comments, that if there weren't so many violent people running around loose, this would have not happened.
Margie
2:47 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Thank you for this comment! People DO kill! Why is this country so obsessed with gun ownership when so many innocent people die every year at the hands of crazy folks who have guns? Is their right-to-own more important that the innocents' rights to live?
CLB45
2:52 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Margie,
Do you really think that taking guns away from law abiding citizens will stop the killing? Gun ownership is important because people should have the right to defend themselves.
Demetri Sarinopoulos
2:59 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Albert: NYC has VERY strict gun control laws as we do. You must not be a felon, etc. There are so many willing to make a buck selling bullets and weapons, that is the issue. If you realy want a weapon any where on Earth, including the UK, cash will supply one every time. The ONLY reason Japan did nit invade the USA, they admitted it was because we are armed. I would be dead today if i did not have a weapon. A person was crawling into my den window at 3 a.m. Do you think they were after cookies and milk, nah to kill me for for undercover work.
Nancy Hall
3:09 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
OK. If guns weren't so readily available, this shooting might not have happened. The problem is that we're trying to close the barn door after the horses have escaped and scattered. Even if we imposed stricter gun regulations today, it would take generations to get guns out of the hands of people who will use them to hurt the innocent. The refusal of fanatics to even consider stricter gun control is a huge part of the problem.
2umarjorie
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
there are so many gun laws on the books, and the goverment want to pass more, not necessary, just enfore the laws that are on the books. if you are willing to commmit a crime, no matter the laws, you will find a way to obtain a gun. it happens all the time. makes no difference if they are not ready availabe, thay will find a way.
Lynne Radcliffe
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Maybe because most people have the common sense to realize that criminals commit crimes & they'll get tools to do so no matter what laws say they're not allowed to.
Have you ever tried to buy a gun?
Go to a store & try to buy one, then tell me how "readily available" they are... after the background check & the 48-hour wait (for a handgun). Then tell me that you honestly believe criminals go to dealers or are affected by any laws (other than after they're caught after breaking them).
It's not the tools that are the problem, it's the people.
The "man" who committed this crime is the problem, & he's now dead. How do we prevent others from doing the same thing? How about having an officer go home with people once they have a restraining order slapped on them and _right_ _then_ taking their guns & giving them to the intended victim? That way the victim is able to defend herself & it'll be a little while before the abuser can re-arm.
And how about teaching our daughters to respect themselves enough to get away from any male who doesn't treat them right - right away, no waiting, no second chances? They should be able to stand up for themselves, mentally & physically.
And teach our sons to be good people, not jealous, possessive, violent, abusive.
Dave K I
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
albert:Here's a comment for you.Assume guns weren't readily available then knives,axe's,explosives,and all manner of other weapons would be used and this same debate on weapons would still be going on.If people want to kill they will it is the nature of things.
Just because the wacko might not be able to find a gun,he WILL find a way and not all the sudden be cured of being a wacko.
Randy1949
2:12 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
How about for once we all stop finger-pointing and speculating until we know the facts behind the incident?
Bmakg
2:15 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
(Albert)
How about you move to Canada if you don't like it.
Susan
2:18 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
albert sheridan:
It isn't the AVAILABILITY of guns that bothers me, but the TYPE of weapons used - in this case a witness believes it was a 'machine gun'. Weapons like this and assault weapons which are used by soldiers have no place in society - they are NOT used for hunting and 'sportsmanship' as so many complain about and should be banned but thanks to the NRA and republican politicians, this cannot happen. These weapons are used for KILLING people only and have no place in society.
Steve ®
2:23 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Witnesses are stupid and even more are uneducated about guns like yourself. Fully automatic weapons are illegal. An AR type weapon may look like a "machine gun" but it still is semi automatic. You can shoot 7 people with a common hand gun.
john monaghan
3:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Sounds more like a pellet gun if he shot that many people and none life threating , Machine gun a machine gun doesn't go pow pow pow it goes rrrrrrrrr , assualt weapons are nothing but suoped up hunting rifles still have to pull the trigger for each shot .
Demetri Sarinopoulos
3:10 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Susan, as a former officer, any thing that shoots more than one round is a "machine gun, from old movies. Legally, only semi automatic weapons are available, legally and illegally. If one wants a weapon, they can get it, money talks. Look at NYC and Chicago, even their laws do NOT work. I am alive today because I am armed. A person was crawling into my den window at 3 a.m. He was not looking for milk and cookies. A 12 year old yeaterday saved her life because she used the family weapon as she was being told on her cell phone and shot through the closet door wounding a suspect. If not, anouter 12 year old would have vanished. We live in a VERY dangerous world, innocence is gone. I see murder every day because that is the offense of choice. Saturday Night specials...
Joseph
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Full auto is not illegal to own or shoot in the US. Only a few states prohibit them.
Lynne Radcliffe
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Automatic firearms are legal, but heavily regulated & taxed, & therefore expensive. Much too expensive for criminals.
But since the original purpose of the Second Amendment was for citizens to be able to protect themselves, even against a bad government, yes, we should all be able to have the same protections that police & soldiers do.
If something bad happens to me, chances are there will _not_ be an officer or a soldier around to stop it, but I will be there. The intended victim is always on the scene before the police.
BTW "assault weapon" is a made-up term based on a handful of cosmetic & safety features. They don't make a rifle any more or less dangerous, other than as far as they allow people of different sizes (husband & wife, mother & daughter) to use the same firearm, or protect the vision of the shooter against muzzle flash, or allow easier changing of magazines.
KHD
6:21 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
hahahahhhaah, A machine gun?? Get a clue Susan. This state has conceal and carry take advantage of it.
Dave K I
7:35 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Susan what in the world is an assault "weapon"anyway?Soldiers use ASSAULT RIFLES.i think you have little knowledge of firearms and let the media lead you.See that's all it takes with a lot of people a 'witness believes'.'Assault weapons' kill?I have several BATTLE RIFLES that were issued to soldiers in 30.06 and 308 calibers and semi-auto, does that mean they are only for killing people?Probably not since they don't have a black plastic stock or curved mag.sticking out the bottom or a pistol grip(got a couple of those to).Learn a little about guns.
CLB45
6:37 am on Thursday, October 25, 2012
Nancy Hall,
Here's the definition of infringe. "Act so as to limit or undermine (something.)" That's what it means, the Founding Fathers were quite literate. Notice the word LIMIT? And as far as the Militia goes, it has been understood for over 200 years that the Bill of Rights were written as "Individual" Rights. But here is a definition of Militia, just so you will understand.
"I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials." George Mason (3 Elliot, Debates at 425-426)
"The militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves, ... all men capable of bearing arms;..." -- Richard Henry Lee writing in "Letters from the Federal Farmer to the Republic", 1788, page 169.
"Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom? Congress shall have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the People." -- Tench Coxe - 1788.
sandra vargas
2:19 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
We might be seeing more incidents like this if the budget cuts mean cutting number of our police officers all over the USA.
Steve ®
2:24 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Lol really like before cuts they had a full time officer in the spa guarding the door?
Margie
2:54 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I predict we will see more incidents like this, because organizations like the NRA have a choke hold on the senate and congress! There is no reason why anyone in this country should own a gun! We do not need to kill our own food; we do not need to "target" practice; the only reason we have guns to "protect ourselves" is because whoever is trying to attack us also has a gun! The only reason we still have the amendment, is because of the testosterone floating in Washington!
Steve ®
2:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Wow. Lets get rid of the first amendment while we're at it Margie. It would save you some embarrassment.
Nancy Hall
3:59 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Interpreting the 2nd Amendment in a reasonable way would be a good start. There is nothing in the 2nd Amendment that prohibits regulation of gun ownership.
CLB45
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Nancy Hall,
What part of "shall not be infringed upon" do you have trouble understanding? How about we start by inforcing the laws against KILLING people. That would be a good starat.
Margaret
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Margie - Many Americans do kill their own food (in my house we do), respect gun laws and have taken all the proper courses in gun safety. They are not the people in the headlines. Banishing guns will not stop people from harming others. Evil people will still commit crimes, regardless of whether or not guns are legal in this country. They will find a way to get them. I think that the emphasis should be on healing the hatred, violence and apathy that's rampant and spreading in our society. We need to teach our children compassion and empathy and responsibility - so they don't grow up to be monsters like this man. I look at some of the video games, shows on tv, etc. nowadays and its disturbing - this is what our children are growing up with. I was never exposed to such garbage as a young kid - and I do think it desensitizes certain people. Americans have an obsession with violence - and its heartbreaking when they act out with complete disrespect for human life.
Lynne Radcliffe
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Nancy: does the phrase "shall not be infringed" have any meaning to you? It appears several times in the Bill of Rights.
Margie: no reason to own a gun?
I bet the people in the spa desperately wished there was someone with a gun there to stop the criminal intent on murder.
In fact, they called for people with guns as soon as they could get to a phone... once the shooter stopped murdering people. A bit late if you ask me.
When a crime is committed, the intended victim is always there. Police, almost never.
That is why I carry a pistol for my own protection.
Nancy Hall
9:42 pm on Wednesday, October 24, 2012
The word "infringe" doesn't mean that there can't be regulation. The 2nd Amendment also talks about well regulated (there's that word..."regulated") militias. Maybe that means that the only people who are members of militias should have guns.
Menoparent
2:25 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Machine guns should be outlawed, thanks to the GOP and NRA funding their campaigns this is what we get, mass shoutings. If this man had a small hand gun, he would not have been able to shoot so many as once like in Aurora.
Steve ®
2:28 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Machine guns are outlawed. How dumb are you?
Menoparent
2:30 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
semi automatic weaponry was used in Aurora, meaning lots of bullets without reloading.
patriot_warrior
2:33 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
you really have no idea what you're talking about ...
Steve ®
2:37 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
A semi auto weapon is not a machine gun. Welcome to the 20th century where we can have more than one bullet before reloading. You want to go back to a muzzleloader?
Lynne Radcliffe
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
You are clueless. Maybe we should have stricter regulation on the First Amendment to prevent posts like yours.
Automatic firearms are legal, but heavily regulated & taxed, so expensive.
The Aurora shooting was committed with semiautomatic guns - pull the trigger once, it fires once. The problem in Aurora is that the theater was a posted "gun-free" zone, so none of the good law-abiding citizens were able to protect themselves.
And the size of the handgun doesn't have a whole lot to do with capacity. My smallest holds 11 rounds, the largest (which also has the highest capacity) holds 18. There's close to an inch difference in the grip length & probably closer to 2" in the slide/barrel. And they're the same caliber.
Both can be reloaded fairly quickly when the magazine is empty.
KHD
6:25 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Some of you people are SO misinformed. omg.
CLB45
2:27 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Ignorant people like you think anything that isn't a muzzle loader is a "machine" gun. Do you even have a clue what kinds of weapons are used by "soldiers" or hunters, or recreational shooters? Instead of worrying about what kind of a gun was used in this crime, and trying to blame the NRA, you all should be trying to stop the culture of violence that is taking over this country. Listen to rap music a, look at the rap videos, and watch the movies and video games that people play today, then try and tell me this is the NRA's fault.
Steve ®
2:33 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
These stories seem to always bring out the dumbest commenters. They have no education on weapons or have used any yet think they know the best to regulate and laws needed. Their ignorance is funny yet scary.
Menoparent
2:33 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
It's very clear that this country is either unable or unwilling to effectively keep guns out of the hands of mentally ill or otherwise who should not have guns. And then this state makes it okay to carry???!!! How in Aurora or here has an outside person's handgun helped out or in AZ?
Steve ®
2:43 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
You really need to pay attention or research before posting
http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/aldi-customer-wont-be-charged-in-shooting-sk42et0-138688529.html?ipad=y
Lets see. If say the receptionist had a gun she could have taken him out. Or if the movie theater not banned guns guaranteeing only a criminal would have one could he have been taken out sooner.
CLB45
2:43 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Here, http://www.pulpless.com/gunclock/stats.html How about the approx 2.5 million times a year a gun stops a crime, that doesn't get reported by the Liberal Press.
Demetri Sarinopoulos
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
You really need to get your brain in motion before you get your finger in gear. Laws prevent those people from legally getting a weapon. Again, if the receptionist was armed, the shooter would be the one injured. This man went berserk. He was out of work, for how long? His wife was leaving him. Do YOU know where he got the weapon, theft, illegal purchase or ? If I were the owner of that business, I would have hired an armed "rent a cop". The activities preceeding this shooting, indicate escalation and someone should have recognized this. This was preventable.
Dave K I
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Menoparent- read about the other Aurora shooting.You must have seen the article about it. Off duty police officer goes to church wacko comes in and manages to kill one before being shot?Sure it didn't garner the attention the theater shooting did because only 2 were shot(including shooter).
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Next time you want to exercise your 1A right to expression, please put your brain in gear first.
It's been legal to carry a firearm for self-protection or other lawful purposes since WI became a state. The only change that happened last year was that the state _slightly_ eased its infringement of that right & made a legal way for citizens to carry discreetly.
That only affected law-abiding citizens, the ones who are willing to undergo yet another background check & be on a government list.
Obviously this "man", this mass murderer, this abuser, was not a law-abiding citizen.
And as others have pointed out, depending on which study you read, lawfully-armed citizens use firearms to defend themselves between 1-2.5 MILLION times a year.
That's 2700-6800 times EVERY DAY.
100-250 times EVERY HOUR.
About once every 30 seconds.
Tell us that's a bad thing.
In fact, Fox 6 in Milwaukee reported yesterday that the intended victim of a robbery in Milwaukee shot & killed his attacker. That's exactly how it works.
The intended victim is always present when a crime is being committed.
Police seldom are.
patriot_warrior
2:38 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
this, like any death, is tragic. but let's remember it was perpetrated by a person NOT an inanimate object (e.g. firearm). despite what the media tells you, multiple-victim public shootings happen across the world, including in countries where there is extremely strict gun control.
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
The only reason this came to public attention is that they were all shot at once, in one place. Similar tolls happen nightly in Chicago, that bastion of gun-control, and more than weekly in Milwaukee.
Jerry Bolton
2:39 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Don't bring the shooter to jail. Bring him to the morgue.
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Don't worry, he killed himself.
Wish he'd just done that up front.
Randy1949
2:42 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Oh, for bleep's sake, can we for once not politicize this? And if not, can anyone direct me to a source of legitimate news? I'd like to know the circumstances and the motive for this act, not to mention when they have the shooter in custody. This is very close to where I live.
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Watch WTMJ TV.
Recently reported that the guy shot himself & is dead.
I can't say as that upsets me too much, though I feel sorry for his family & children.
Dave K I
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Randy I agree but unfortunately it will be politicized so the anti gun crowd in DC can take the banner and run with and say we told you so.
Joe Johnson
2:45 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Once again no mention of RACE. Friggin' NAACP and ACLU, thank you.
Carl Spackler
2:51 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
amen. finally someone eles see's it! this "man' is black. there I said it.
Dave
2:47 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
The hard times that we have been living in, are driving people to desparate acts of violence almost daily. It's time we change direction as a country and get back to a place where this type of behavior is the exception, and not the daily news.
Nekhbet
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
This is nothing "new" . It just hits the social media faster than it did a thousand or so years ago .
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
This has nothing to do with "hard times", but rather the blame lies in our culture of violence & the possessiveness felt by some "men".
If he had been working, he'd still be an abuser, probably still harming his wife & children. Being out of work only accellerated the process.
If this were motivated by economics, he would have robbed a bank.
Carl Spackler
2:49 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
So, another "man" from the neighborhood with a machine gun. Those guys are not men. Men take care of their children, don't do drugs and don't abuse their wives. And what will Eugene Kane say about this? Oh, it is the white man's fault. Now many lives will be destroyed because of the "man". We need to have capital punishment for killers. NOW.
Funny how they avoided the killer color. Oh, that's right, we don't see color. BS.
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
He didn't have a machine gun.
But I agree with you about this person not being a man.
greensheet
2:52 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Once again, an act committed by an individual with NO SELF CONTROL. An epidemic on this planet.
pail diiorio
3:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I am not an NRA supporter as they tend
to support single issue people.
But my owning an AK47 does not
make me a criminal nor is it
an assault weapon despite
what many ignorant people
think. Guns are fun and safe
when used properly. The fault
lies fully with the folks who
act illegally. I am and will
remain an armed liberal
with respect for the law.
Paul
Tallahassee
Nuitari
3:01 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Another reason for CC. Azana probably has the window sticker banning them though.
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
According to one Milwaukee PD officer, it is indeed a "gun-free zone".
And the estranged wife had a "protective order".
Those worked out real well, didn't they?
Nekhbet
3:06 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Love reading these comments . Great source of entertainment !
AWD
6:02 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Restraining orders hurt women. I've never read a story where a restraining order worked. One thing that does work is buying a handgun, getting your conceal carry license, train a little at a range and wear that firearm 24-7. Because of where these women worked they was defenseless, The No Guns Allowed sign on their place of work had as much to do with their tragic deaths as the shooter himself.
KHD
6:29 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
When a place of business bans weapons, They are leaving themselves open for a lawsuit. They will not let you excercise your lawful right to carry.
Nekhbet
3:08 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
And Yes , some of you are true idiots .
Nuitari
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
http://wcca.wicourts.gov/pager.do;jsessionid=A937A7F922019CBA796AD4C30B1BD092.render6?cacheId=A8BDEAFB6419FF23720F6ADE2AF3D2E3&offset=0&sortColumn=0&sortDirection=DESC
mike nelson
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Margie and Menoparent
To say thanks to GOP / NRA funding campaigns this is what we get, mass shoutings shows your NOBAMA drink of the koolaid. While I might agree on the machine outlawed.. to say " If this man had a small hand gun, he would not have been able to shoot so many as once like in Aurora.".. FYI .. 9mm Gloick could have done this, it's a smaller handgun, a 45, a 357, a 38 ..all small hand guns and to think taking guns away from law abiding citizens will stop the killing.. well have another sip of the koolaid.. Yesterday a story of a 12 year killing an intruder that was going to kill her and her family hid in closet and put the intruder where he belonged ..6ft under.. Yes gun ownership is important to defend ones self.. How about this ..murder not kill.. to different things.. by gun.. death.. no death row 1 appeal and death.. would wager crime by gun takes a dive.. how about gangs.. 2 strikes your out.. death.. wager gangs start to go wayside.. just thinking out loud..
Benedons, Inc
4:55 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
sheesh, I don't believe that for a NY minute. How about they start making prison more medieval so no one would want to go there? When political correctness starts to be more important than simply keeping thugs behind bars, we have a problem.
kathy
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
People are funny....
Waukytalk
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I hope they get the guy and take him out!
Greg K
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
OK...how the hell did this become a race issue again? Stirring the ashes of old social ills (but still of immediate concern to our country) smacks of small mindedness and seems to be the first reaction of those incapable of deeper thought.
Three people died and many were wounded. Period. Houghton could have done almost as much damage with a knife and baseball bat but he just happened to have access to firearms, and apparently prepared for a more grisly 'showing' by bringing along an IED. Should we also outlaw metal pipes and end cap purchases out of fear of internet educated pipe bombers?
We all want to be safe. How we all get to that feel-good state of mind is as unique and varied as are opinions on race and gun control. Those discussions have raged for years in a well documented stalemate so therefore 'talking it to death' isn't the answer. Yet here we are...again, mourning the loss of the innocent.
Roar
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
>Three people died and many were wounded. Period. Houghton could have done almost as much damage with a knife and baseball bat but he just happened to have access to firearms --
No he wouldn't. You can be at a distance and run away if you have a gun. Which is precisely what happened. A knife and baseball bat you have to run up to the victims and repeatedly hit/stab them.
I'm pro-gun rights, but realize the reality of this situation.
Lynne Radcliffe
6:23 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Strange how criminals on rampages in Asia manage to kill more than 3 people, & all they have access to is a knife.
I'm pretty sure that in a spa full of unarmed, defenseless people (mostly women) who think that being defenseless is a good thing, he could have done just as much damage, only a little slower, with a knife, a bat, a tire iron...
Roar
12:13 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
>I'm pretty sure that in a spa full of unarmed, defenseless people (mostly women) who think that being defenseless is a good thing, he could have done just as much damage, only a little slower, with a knife, a bat, a tire iron...
Not a little slower, massively slower. I won't deny that there would be damage regardless but imagine having to run from person to person while smashing someone with a bat or stabbing with a knife. In this situation, they could have got authorities there more quickly or even take matters into their own hands if they chose to jump him.
This likely happened in a matter of seconds.
The mass killings in 'Asia' as you so claim, was the Akihabara massacre in Japan in 2008. He stalked, watched, and finally hit the crowd with a truck before going a stabbing spree.
Sorry, it wasn't 'only' a knife.
Menoparent
4:00 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Still missing?? And they waited till now to release his photo??!!
Dave K I
4:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Just ONE wittiness said they thought he had a machine gun?Or could it be THEY haven't decided what he used yet.After all the third debate is coming up,what better fuel for the fire.
I just find it odd there was no mention of what type of weapon used in the entire article other than just that one witiness saying machine gun.
NObama 2012
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Chopper 4 with Power Zoom did us a service today. Did you see the Obama 2012 sign in the Brown Deer yard of Brookfield shooter Radcliffe F. Haughton? Very revealing.
AWD
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Radcliffe F. Haughton took the war on women to the next level didn't he.
Jason J
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
It is a tragedy for all the victims in this shooting, except for the shooter he killed himself, should have done it first. As for me this senseless mass shooting craze that is sweeping the US, means... wait for it .... Not banning guns! But reminds me everyday why I carry a concealed weapon regardless of the posted no guns signs.
I will take the being asked to leave if somehow the sheep who are working that place notice my weapon. They haven't since I got my permit.
These shooters are turning Smart Americans into Smart armed Americans.
This is not the country I grew up in and it is a nightmare to see it turning into this armed camp.
However to not train, practice and carry a weapon legally nowadays is just foolish.
Dave K I
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Margie
2:47 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
"Thank you for this comment! People DO kill! Why is this country so obsessed with gun ownership when so many innocent people die every year at the hands of crazy folks who have guns? Is their right-to-own more important that the innocents' rights to live?"
You made my point and a lot of other peoples as well.So innocent people deserve to die because yuo think they shouldn't be able to fend themselves?
NObama 2012
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Radcliffe F. Haughton - Obama supporter. Check out the Chopper 4 with Power Zoom view of his Brown Deer yard. Obama 2012 sign proudly displayed.
Randy1949
6:23 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
NObama, you are a real piece of work.
Dave K I
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Margie:I take it you don't have a gun on the place.Gee I do hope that you don't get woke up in the middle of the night by someone kicking down your front or backdoor or trying to get in a window,maybe you might rethink your no guns and wish you had one and knew how to use it.
Lynne Radcliffe
5:34 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
He's been found dead in the spa.
Too bad he couldn't have just shot himself in his home & left other people alone.
gg
5:51 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I am ultra-conservative, BUT this gun stuff has got to stop. In my small town there are billboard size signs once a year for the "gun show" coming to town. It makes me shudder. Guns are for killing, nothing else! You want hunting turn the guns in to the police dept. and let them keep them when it's not in season. With a knife or bat, you can defend yourself with a gun YOU ARE DONE.
J Manola
6:26 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
knives and bats aren't very effective against guns. You must be a fool to think the "Bad guys" will give up there guns.
CLB45
11:58 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
I have a clear picture of a 70 year old woman defending herself with a knife, from a 6 ft drug crazed person invading her home. She would be DONE allright. Not everyone has a Victim mentality like you seem to. If a sign for a "gun show" makes you shudder, you may need to see a Dr. because you have a severe mental problem.
Randy1949
5:55 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Here's a thought -- perhaps we should be calling for better mental health services rather than gun control.
MMOV
7:10 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
I believe we need both. There's often pompous, arrogant sneering by gun owners about how people for gun control don't know the proper names for the guns that can shoot off multiple rounds in a matter of seconds because they'd rather not deal with the harsh reality that those guns, whatever you CALL them, are getting into the hands of the mentally unstable.
Our mental health care system is broken, but that conversation is ignored by mainstream media and gets overshadowed in the gun control conversations. I fear we may never have that conversation.
I also think we need mental wellness to be a part of our culture. Too many men have no idea how to manage difficult emotions and when they get overwhelmed by fear and anger, take it out on innocent people. Women are more likely to take it out on themselves, but because of their connections to others, they can do a lot of psychological--and physical--damage to themselves and the people around them through substance abuse.
CLB45
12:03 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
MMOV....Exactly how would you prevent "mentally ill" people from obtaining firearms, as that is already against the law. Do you really think that having a "law" will make "law BREAKERS" obey it? And if you are that ignorant about firearms and firearm nomenclature, why would anyone think you know anything about mental health, and pay attention to what you say?
AWD
5:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Just this week crime figures from Milwaukee show that violent crime was 2.7% higher in the first eight months of this year compared with the same period in 2011, driven by an 18% spike in aggravated assaults during that time. I dare any of you do-gooders to come and take my legally purchased firearm. We need more firearms in the hands of the population not less. Everyone should be armed 24/7, I am.
Dave K I
7:53 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Like they say AWD an arm society is a polite society.Couldn't agree more.
william stauffiger
6:39 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
weres our ponny boy clark? why didnt he get the guns the same day as the restraining order? oh ya everybody was lifting weights ans watching big screen tv. thanks lot mr. i know everything.
Lasvegasbadger
6:44 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I was listening to this on the internet scanner and it makes me wonder why the cops spent so much time looking for the guy when he was in the salon the whole time?
It took a lot of resources off the streets and caused a lot of panic. How soon after the call did the cops make entry to the building?
Steve ®
7:48 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
He was in a locked room that was suspected to be wired to an ied.
gg
7:50 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I felt the same way. Why didn't they go in the building and LOOK, instead of causing more drama.
Steve ®
8:13 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
The cops thought a small propane tank was a home made nuclear weapon.
Lasvegasbadger
6:45 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
I might add, mom lives just a little bit away from the Mall and she was scared.
And my compliments to the Patch crew and their good reporting on the shooting.
Matthew Schroeder
7:02 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Thank you for the compliment, Lasvegasbadger.
Steve ®
7:47 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Did Obama blame this on a YouTube video yet?
william stauffiger
7:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
stay tuned on monday night, he mans up and tells the whole truth!
Dave K I
8:02 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Steve you have no faith in him, he is only trying to work the right angle on a video.In other words make sure he don't get caught up.
Steve ®
8:11 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Maybe he can invite the victims for a beer and make everyone get along.
Jacob R
6:45 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
Don't be silly the victims were middle class women, Obama is secretly applauding this, it is taking his war on the middle class to the final steps.
Evelyn Williams
8:57 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Unbelievable! If this man were purple with pink polka dots the fact remains that he committed an unspeakable act upon innocent victims. A pregnant woman was among the victims. Domestic violence crimes are crimes of passion not racially or politically motivated crimes. My heart goes out to all of the victims and their families
John Brown
9:04 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
Unfortunately this cowardly piece of excrement chose to kill defenseless unarmed women rather than just ending his waste of an existence life as he should have.
A tragedy. This story is not about guns, it's a story about women and their choices. Choosing to coddle a support a no good ignorant POS for years and years will almost always end badly for all involved. Women, don't support, tolerate, make excuses for and allow men to use and abuse you. Not for one second. Ever. Zero tolerance. All girls should be raised to never allow parasitic abusive loser boys and men to be in their lives.
Yecchh. So sad.
Conservative in Greendale
9:33 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
nicely said, I "stole" it and posted to FB
nkg
10:44 pm on Sunday, October 21, 2012
At least the taxpayers won't have to waste money on this loser's "defense"! At least he took himself out. No loss.
John Brown
12:16 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
No loss? What about the people he killed and injured and their families and loved ones?
Karen G
1:21 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
I am really appalled reading many of the messages posted here. Do you not understand the depth of the tragedies that have occurred here in Milwaukee and the Country over the past several years? Lives were lost, parents lost their children, children lost their parents, etc., and what I am reading is so very shallow.
I happened to be there around 12:30 today and the scene was horrific. I have never seen so many police cars, ambulances, and officers in one place ever with more continually arriving.
It really saddens me to read the comments against "one" single shooter being addressed as the "black man". What about the "white man" at the shooting this summer? Who cares, black or white, but please don't stoop to this level when such a horrendous crime has been committed.
Then there is the continuous writing of gun control. Isn't it easy to digress into a subject that is meaningless after the fact then look at what is taking place in our society? Gun control or not, this individual was very disturbed and we, as a society, are all paying a huge price. These people will find a way to kill one way or another and they will continue if something doesn't change...
This killings are tragedies that have to be addressed at a "human" level and yes, they are/were all human beings. I applaud the M.A.T.C teacher who tried to intervene in this man's life. Maybe if we all did a little more caring/action then pointing our fingers we might just change our world.
John Brown
2:08 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
Condescension and arrogance are likely character traits which you shared with this abusive cowardly killer. How's the air up there, Princess?
Karen G
4:06 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
It is quite the opposite John. If I wrote anything that gave you this impression, I apologize. I do believe we need to get ourselves out of our glass houses and know that we are part of this society that is falling apart. We can't continue to point fingers and say it's "their" problem or why doesn't someone do something about "them". "We" are all in this together as ugly and horrible as it is, we have to work toward doing what we can individually and corporately. This in no way negates personnel responsible and accountability as this is what keeps a society in check. This is what the criminal justice system is for. However, they are being swamped with cases and they are reactionary in nature. I am not saying we all become social workers or psychologist either as I don't believe the answers all lie there either. To become better neighbors is what I am trying to convey. How many times do we hear on the news after someone did something horrific "I didn't see anything wrong with them". I think we need to really hear and take time out of our lives to see. Maybe changing some laws and making certain that the ones on the books are enforced is something we can do also. Just some thoughts. Best wishes
Lou Ann Urness
7:41 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
My granddaughter got a text this morning that said 2 of the woman shot were parents of our Horlick Cheer team. My heart and prayers go out to them. This is hitting home Racine.
H.E. Pennypacker
10:07 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
All non felon woman and men need to conceal carry to protect yourself and your family against people like this. What kind of sane person wants to be a victim? Stop the insanity, protect yourself and your neighbors.
Ed Holladay
10:28 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
Most people are not equipped to handle, properly aim and discharge firearms. Arming every citizen to the teeth is not the answer,
People are going to get gunned down if we allow people to carry/ own guns. It is the cost of freedom. That is not going to change.
H.E. Pennypacker
11:01 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
Well Ed, you can certainly throw in the towel and join the ranks of the victims to this kind of violence. That is your choice.
Michelle
10:37 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
my coworkers/friends aunt was shot in this ordeal please pray for her as well as the other surviving victims and families.
Pamela
10:59 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
This man Haughton had a history of criminal abusive behavior. The only reason he wasn't convicted was the witness did not show up for the court hearing. He would have used any weapon he could get his hands on to get revenge or whatever from his wife.
Fred van der Wal
11:39 am on Monday, October 22, 2012
Sum of this is that the second amendment has once more blood on it's hands as do all who support this outdated philosophy.
Law abiding citizens with guns are a risk to society.
You guys can call me stupid,naive or whatever but I simply refuse to be part of a growing society that feels the need to arm themselves so they can feel tougher then the other (criminal) Law abiding citizen.
Dave K I
3:50 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Fred-I am going to go ahead and drag out the old cars kill more people and ask,does this mean that the DMS's have blood on their hands also?Kinda like people feel the need to go drink than drive,blab on their cell's going down the road and texting?I feel the same every time I get in the car and wonder whose going to run that stop sign or light because their attention is elsewhere or drunk off their nut.When they gonna get tough on that?When they gonna pass more laws?When are they gonna actually enforce the ones they do have?I see this stuff every day.
There I drug out the car thing!
John Brown
12:13 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Karen,
Maybe you didn't read my earlier post about women's choices and how girls need to be raised refusing to tolerate from men. Who is in a glass house? Maybe you are.
If you think the criminal justice system does ANYTHING than you're surely naive.
It does not take a village to raise ANYONE. What it takes is parents raising children from day one to respect others, to respect women, to be responsible, to be a man. How these animals were raised is the problem. "We" can't legislate our way out of 26 year old grandmothers and boys and men killing people over a "dirty look" or a pair of gym shoes or who gets to sell crack on which corner. "We" cant dictate in any form how people raise their children to be doormat breeding parasitic hosts or thugs. We can each individually raise our children correctly and hope they are not preyed upon by savages.
Garbage in = garbage out.
Get off your high horse and wake up.
Karen G
3:54 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
John,
I believe your anger has taken over your logic. Police are part of the criminal justice system and they do an excellent job within the parameters of the law.
Peter J G Chiconas
12:18 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Such a tradgity. Scary how fragile our every day life really is!
Fred van der Wal
12:38 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
People like H.E. Asspacker and others like him totally have no idea that people who do not choice to arm themselves feel not like a victim.The need to buy guns for so called protection for something that might or not might happen is just a sign of unable to control ones environment through show of force but little intelligence.
Avenging Angel
12:51 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Meet Fred, product of RUSD and future chalk outline.
Menoparent
12:47 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
After further information as come out now, this is more of domestic violence issue than gun control. Sad that he was not prosecuted a year ago at their home. Sadly, many abuse victims are in denial of the severity of their situation and are afraid to leave due to financial, emotional addictive dependence, they believe their man will change or it's just do to his drinking. Now, I wish all of these women would get the help they need before it effects their children, coworkers, etc. I am not saying that this could have 100% prevented what had happened, but it could have. Prosecutors probably wanted to arrest him, but couldn't because many times the wife and girlfriend changes her mind after calling authorities. Also, why wasn't his gun turned in, couldn't they have searched him home when the restraining order was issued? A year ago, he was found waving a gun in him home???
David Tatarowicz
3:26 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
@Menoparent You are definitely correct that this was a domestic issue and not a gun issue.
And it is sad that many abuse victims do not seek help --- in a way, they are often as emotionally disturbed as their tormentor.
Domestic abuse itself is most often an issue of "Control" --- that is why so many narcissists are prone to it, both mental and physical. They want complete control and domination.
One counselor I talked with told me about a guy who hung his two German shepherds in the basement --- and we often hear of children who torture or torment animals, later on in life becoming abusers.
Anybody can become a victim if they do not get help, and again, they are often incapable of doing so. I even know a counselor whose x husband ran her over with his car -- and then backed up over her again !!!
Guns are a non-issue, and in fact may contribute to the abuse problem. Women know if they file a Domestic, their husband can lose his guns, and also his hunting license. That is why courts often do deferred punishment, as it is the dirty secret of Domestic violence.
Unfortunately, there are no easy answers.
H.E. Pennypacker
4:00 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
There is a simple easy answer...Conceal Carry. My FN 57 or my Ruger .44 mag are the great equalizers for thugs like this jamaican.
Community Lady
1:47 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
He was a former marine. Was he a vet? Did he have PTSD? Clearly there is mental illness here. How can we, as a society, help prevent these kinds of incidents? I think ther are many ways, regardless of what kind of mental illness this is.
Citizen 10
2:42 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
If ten years ago you mentioned that PTSD was an issue I might have some sympathy for that excuse, but in this day and age having a mental health problem doesn't have the stigma it once did attached to it. You go and get help. The VA is/ was just a few miles east. He made a wrong turn.
Dave K I
3:54 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
PTSD? sure why not that's always good to blame something on.No doubt there is an illness but just because he was a Marine don't mean PTSD.
AWD
2:34 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Suppose you or your family is being stalked by a criminal who intends to harm you. Would you feel safer putting a sign in front of your dwelling saying "This home is a gun-free zone"? Would it frighten criminals away? Good intentions don't necessarily make good laws. Too many gun laws primarily disarm law-abiding citizens, not criminals. More guns in the hands of law abiding citizens is the key to a safe society.
Benedons, Inc
4:57 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
hear hear!!!
Citizen 10
2:54 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Our volunteer armed services needs to do a better job screening who they train to use a variety of guns. So many gang members and other criminals go in to "play" with the neat "toys" our government owns. Officers have to pass a psychological test to get in the academy, same should go for anyone who wants to join the armed services. Stress tests, interviews, the whole gammet, just like officers. Mandatory exit check-ups to receive benefits as well.
CLB45
3:03 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Apparently you have never tried to join any Military service. You have to be a High School Graduate. You can't have any felony convictions. They give all kinds of tests, and I would say basic training is the greatest stress test you will every get. I love it when clueless Liberals come on these comment boards and call for laws and regulations that have been in place for years.
Fred van der Wal
3:23 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
@AWD But when does a "law-abiding citizens" suddenly finds the need to go and shoot his fellow workers and or family.How does that fit into your and most other philosophy.Next time you promote that employees take their weapons to the work place for something that might or might not happen.
No thank you.
CLB45
3:48 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Fine, you can continue to be a potential victim. You talk as if you think the gun causes a person to suddenly decide to start shooting people. Surely you aren't that ignorant?
Bren
4:01 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
How is less important to me than why.
James R Hoffa
4:35 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
Hey everyone, be sure to check out Hoffa's list of the Top 10 original songs made specifically for use in your favorite horror movies:
http://mountpleasant.patch.com/blog_posts/hoffas-top-10-horror-movie-songs
And don't forget to leave a comment!
Benedons, Inc
5:00 pm on Monday, October 22, 2012
spoons made me fat. As a gun owner and concealed carrier for decades, WITHOUT INCIDENT, it is my humble opinion that making weapons illegal is the wrong road. It's the person, not the gun. What worries me as much as this, are the people who think they'll get a gun to protect themselves and/or others, and have ZERO training.